{"id":53929,"date":"2019-05-16T21:55:27","date_gmt":"2019-05-16T19:55:27","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/schillerinstitute.com\/?p=53929\/"},"modified":"2019-05-20T19:40:55","modified_gmt":"2019-05-20T17:40:55","slug":"helga-zepp-larouche-discusses-belt-and-road-initiative-with-gbtimes","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/2.schillermeet.de\/de\/blog\/2019\/05\/16\/helga-zepp-larouche-discusses-belt-and-road-initiative-with-gbtimes\/","title":{"rendered":"Helga Zepp-LaRouche Discusses Belt and Road Initiative with GBTimes"},"content":{"rendered":"<p><span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">[<strong>Transcript included<\/strong>] Helga Zepp-LaRouche gave an excellent 42-minute video <a href=\"https:\/\/gbtimes.com\/helga-zepp-larouche-discusses-chinas-belt-and-road-initiative-video\">interview<\/a><\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">to GBTimes&#8216; Senior Editor Asa Butcher on May 10.\u00a0 GBTimes is a<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">Chinese multimedia site based in Finland, and established to<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">enhance a dialogue between China and Europe.\u00a0<\/span><\/span><\/span><\/p>\n<p><iframe loading=\"lazy\" title=\"Helga Zepp-LaRouche discusses China&amp;apos;s Belt and Road initiative\" width=\"860\" height=\"484\" src=\"https:\/\/www.youtube.com\/embed\/xVv2OhLKzPk?feature=oembed\" frameborder=\"0\" allow=\"accelerometer; autoplay; clipboard-write; encrypted-media; gyroscope; picture-in-picture; web-share\" referrerpolicy=\"strict-origin-when-cross-origin\" allowfullscreen><\/iframe><\/p>\n<hr \/>\n<h2>Transcript<\/h2>\n<p><span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">GBTimes: We&#8217;ll begin.\u00a0 I&#8217;m going to focus on the Belt and<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">Road Initiative today, following on from the Forum in Beijing<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">last week.\u00a0 If you could describe your feelings on the outcome of<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">the Forum that concluded last week in Beijing.<\/span><\/span><\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">HELGA ZEPP-LAROUCHE:\u00a0 Oh, I think it was very a really<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">important progress as compared to the first Belt and Road Forum.<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">The first Belt and Road Forum was filled with optimism and the<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">knowledge of all the participants that we were experiencing the<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">birth of a new system of international relations \u2014 that was<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">already extremely important.\u00a0 But I think the Second Belt and<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">Road Forum saw a consolidation of that, so you have actually a<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">new system of international relations which is overcoming<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">geopolitics, and I think this is one of the most important<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">outcomes, apart from, naturally, the enormous economic<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">development which was presented.\u00a0 But I think the idea that you<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">have a system which has a win-win possibility for everybody to<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">cooperate, is the way to overcome geopolitics, and that is the<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">remaining danger, which after all, caused two world wars in the<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">last century.\u00a0 So this is a real breakthrough for humanity.<\/span><\/span><\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">GBTimes:\u00a0 There&#8217;s been a growing criticism and backlash<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">against the BRI.\u00a0 Do you think this is misunderstanding,<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">suspicion toward this new system?\u00a0 What are your thoughts on<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">that?<\/span><\/span><\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">ZEPP-LAROUCHE:\u00a0 It&#8217;s actually a temporary phenomenon,<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">because the funny thing was, here you had the largest<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">infrastructure program in history, ever, with enormous changes<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">for Africa, for Latin America, for Asia, even for European<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">countries, and the Western media and think-tanks pretended it did<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">not exist for almost four years!\u00a0 And then, all of a sudden, they<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">realized, &#8222;Oh, this is really growing so rapidly; it is including<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">more than 100 countries.&#8220; So they started what I think was a<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">coordinated attack, slandering the Belt and Road Initiative, with<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">arguments which I think can all individually can be proven to be<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">a lie.\u00a0 It comes from the old geopolitical effort to control the<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">world by manipulating countries against each other, and with the<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">Belt and Road Initiative, I think that possibility is vanishing,<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">and that&#8217;s why they&#8217;re so angry and hysterical.<\/span><\/span><\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">GBTimes: What could China do to reduce this demonization of<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">the BRI?<\/span><\/span><\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">ZEPP-LAROUCHE:\u00a0 I think China is already doing a lot.\u00a0 For<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">example, even <em>Handelsblatt<\/em>, which was very negative towards the<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">Belt and Road Initiative in the past, they had to bring an<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">article which brought out the fact that the whole argument that<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">China is putting the countries of the third world into a &#8222;debt<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">trap&#8220; is not holding.\u00a0 For example, the IMF just released figures<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">that there are 17 African countries which may not be able to pay<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">their debt, but China is only engaged in 3 of them, and all of<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">the others have huge debts to the Paris Club and to other big<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">Western banks \u2014 so, who&#8217;s putting whom into a debt trap?<\/span><\/span><\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">All of these arguments will be very easy to counter-argue,<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">and the more China makes known its beautiful culture, people will<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">be won over.\u00a0 Because the beauty of Chinese painting, of<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">Classical music, it will win over the hearts.\u00a0 And the most<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">people understand what China is actually doing, the less these<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">attacks will be possible to maintain.<\/span><\/span><\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">GBTimes:\u00a0 The attacks are more on China than on the Belt and<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">Road Initiative, you say?<\/span><\/span><\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">ZEPP-LAROUCHE:\u00a0 Well, yes.\u00a0 They&#8217;re on China because China<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">is the major motor behind it.\u00a0 And some of the attacks were that<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">China is supposedly an autocratical dictatorship, and<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">surveillance state and all of these things.\u00a0 But first of all,<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">concerning surveillance, I think the NSA and the GCHQ have<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">outdone anybody already.\u00a0 And naturally China has a system which<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">uplifts the morality of the people:\u00a0 This is based on the<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">Confucian tradition, and for some of the very liberal people in<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">the West, that is already too much, because it disturbs their<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">idea that everything goes, everything is allowed, and from that<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">standpoint, any kind of emphasis on morality is too much for<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">these people.<\/span><\/span><\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">GBTimes:\u00a0 Isn&#8217;t sometimes criticism of new ideas and<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">initiatives healthy? It&#8217;s what we understand here in the West, we<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">don&#8217;t openly unquestionably accept new things.\u00a0 We do question,<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">and we are a little bit cynical sometimes.<\/span><\/span><\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">ZEPP-LAROUCHE:\u00a0 It&#8217;s superfluous.\u00a0 It&#8217;s a waste of energy<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">and it distracts people from accomplishing what needs to be<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">accomplished: Namely, to overcome poverty in Africa, in Latin<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">America, even in Europe.\u00a0 You know, Europe has 90 million poor<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">people, and I have not seen a plan by the European Union to<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">overcome poverty by 2010, which China intends to do with its own<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">poor people.<\/span><\/span><\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">So I think it&#8217;s a waste of energy, and it comes from what I<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">call, when people put on geopolitical spectacles and have<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">neocolonial headphones, then they see and hear the world quite<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">differently from what it is, namely, they only project their own<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">views.<\/span><\/span><\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">GBTimes:\u00a0 Having been writing about China for the last 5-7<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">years, it has made a dramatic entrance onto the world stage, when<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">I started writing about it many years ago.\u00a0 And the speed of its<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">arrival, the size of the investments, it can scare a lot of<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">countries \u2014 just family and friends who don&#8217;t know much about<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">China, they want to know about my job where I&#8217;m introducing China<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">to the West, as this bridge.\u00a0 There&#8217;s a lot of a<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">misunderstandings.\u00a0 Do you think some of it comes from this<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">ignorance? And how could that be changed?<\/span><\/span><\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">ZEPP-LAROUCHE:\u00a0 I have the feeling that everybody who was in<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">China, either as a tourist or as a business person, investing or<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">trading, they all come back and they have a very, very positive<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">view.\u00a0 People are impressed about what they see, the really<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">incredible fast train system.\u00a0 Then, if you go in the region of<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">Shenzhen, Zhuhai, Guangdong, Macao, Hong Kong, this is the<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">powerhouse of the world economy, not just the Belt and Road<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">Initiative.<\/span><\/span><\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">Compare that with the decrepit infrastructure in the United<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">States or many parts of Western Europe, for example.\u00a0 Less than<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">two years ago, I was in Zhuhai at a conference, and we visited<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">this bridge between Hong Kong and Zhuhai and Macao, linking this<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">entire triangular:\u00a0 And this bridge was built, I think, in six<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">years or eight years, including planning!\u00a0 Now, in Germany, we<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">have a famous bridge between Mainz and Wiesbaden, which has been<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">in repair for almost six to eight years, and it&#8217;s still not<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">ready!<\/span><\/span><\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">So, I think if people go to China, they come back and they<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">are completely impressed, because they see that in China, people<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">have now virtues, like industriousness, ingenuity, creativity \u2014<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">these are all values we used to have in the West, like when the<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">Germany economic miracle was made in the postwar reconstruction,<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">these values and virtues were German.\u00a0 But now, no longer.\u00a0 Now,<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">we have all kinds of other crazy ideas, and therefore China is<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">taking the lead.<\/span><\/span><\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">So the people who go to China come back with a positive<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">image, and those who have not been, naturally, they&#8217;re scared by<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">the negative reports in the media.\u00a0 So the more people can<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">actually go and form their own image, the better.<\/span><\/span><\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">GBTimes:\u00a0 I have myself, I&#8217;ve seen a disconnect between<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">China and Chinese society, and then the role of the Chinese<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">government, the more negative side that gets covered about in the<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">Western media.\u00a0 Do you think, for instance, with the BRI is just<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">a way to legitimize the Chinese leadership in the world, and to<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">raise it up to the same level that is given to the other<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">countries?\u00a0 Do you think that&#8217;s acceptable?<\/span><\/span><\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">ZEPP-LAROUCHE: Well, it is a challenge.\u00a0 Some of the Western<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">institutions talked about that there is now a competition of the<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">systems, meaning the Chinese state model and the Western free<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">market model. And in one sense, it is true; the only problem is<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">that if you have the neo-liberal system, especially after the<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">crisis of 2008, only favoring monetarist interests \u2014 the banks,<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">the speculators \u2014 and the gap between the rich and the poor<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">becomes ever wider, naturally, then, if you have a country where<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">that is not the case, namely, China having a policy which is<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">oriented toward the common good, an increasing well-to-do middle<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">class of 300 million people, which in 5-10 years will be 600<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">million people, and obviously the vector of development is<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">upward, naturally that is regarded as a threat by the neo-liberal<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">establishment, which only takes care of its own privileges.<\/span><\/span><\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">So in a certain sense, the challenge does exist, but I think<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">there is the possibility of a learning process, so one can be<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">hopeful that even some elements of the Western elites will<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">recognize that China is doing something right.<\/span><\/span><\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">GBTimes:\u00a0 What do you think China could learn from the<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">Western mode?\u00a0 And vice versa, what do you think the two could<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">learn from one another?<\/span><\/span><\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">ZEPP-LAROUCHE:\u00a0 I think China can learn a lot from the West,<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">but I&#8217;m afraid to say, not from the present, contemporaries, or,<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">there is very little to learn.\u00a0 Naturally, ESA cooperating with<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">the Chinese space agency, there is a lot of exchange possible.<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">But in terms of general, cultural outlook, I think China has to<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">go back about 200 years to find positive things in Europe, or the<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">United States, for that matter.\u00a0 You know, European Classical<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">culture can be an enormous enrichment for China, but these are<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">composers who are Bach, Mozart, Beethoven, Schubert, Schumann, or<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">great poets.\u00a0 But these are all things which, unfortunately are<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">not dominating the cultural outlook of most Europeans and<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">Americans today.\u00a0 So there has to be a dialogue across the<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">centuries, and then both sides can profit from each other.<\/span><\/span><\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">GBTimes: In a sense, you&#8217;re very pessimistic about the<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">Western stands at the moment.\u00a0 Do you think China is the only<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">option available to the West at the moment?<\/span><\/span><\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">ZEPP-LAROUCHE:\u00a0 No, I&#8217;m not pessimistic, I&#8217;m just saying<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">that you see that some of the elites, or so-called elites, are<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">hardened in their view.\u00a0 You have others who are absolutely<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">recognizing that the whole mankind needs to cooperate together in<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">new ways, for example, Switzerland.\u00a0 You know the President of<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">Switzerland, who participated in the Belt and Road Forum just<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">signed a memorandum of understanding, not only for Switzerland,<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">but for a whole group of Central and Eastern European countries,<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">which Switzerland is representing in the international<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">organizations.<\/span><\/span><\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">So there is a big motion.\u00a0 You have Italy signing a<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">memorandum of understanding with China, on the development of<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">Africa.\u00a0 Greece wants to be the gateway between trade from Asia,<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">through the Suez Canal all the way into Europe.\u00a0 Portugal and<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">Spain want to be the hub for the Portuguese- and Spanish-speaking<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">people around the world.<\/span><\/span><\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">So there is a lot of dynamics and motions, I&#8217;m just<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">referring to some of the monetarist views and those people who<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">talk about the &#8222;rules-based order&#8220; all the time, but what they<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">really mean is austerity.<\/span><\/span><\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">So, I&#8217;m not talking about the West in general.\u00a0 I think the<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">West\u00a0 \u2014 I&#8217;m an optimist about the potential of all human beings<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">\u2014 I&#8217;m only talking about certain parts of the establishment in<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">the West.<\/span><\/span><\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">GBTimes:\u00a0 You mentioned Italy and Switzerland.\u00a0 How<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">significant is it that they signed up to the BRI now?<\/span><\/span><\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">ZEPP-LAROUCHE:\u00a0 I think this is extremely important.\u00a0 First<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">of all, Italy, as you know, is the third largest economy in<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">Europe.\u00a0 The north of Italy is highly industrialized and has a<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">lot of industrial capability; many hidden champions actually are<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">in northern Italy.\u00a0 So, if such a country is now, as the first G7<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">country, officially joining with a memorandum of understanding,<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">this can become the model for all of Europe.\u00a0 And Prime Minister<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">Giuseppe Conte who just participated in the Belt and Road Forum<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">came back and said exactly that: That Italy plans to be the<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">leader in bringing about a better relation between China and<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">Europe.\u00a0 So I think this is extremely important.<\/span><\/span><\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">And Switzerland, even if it may be a small country, they are<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">independent; they are sovereign, they are not part of the<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">European Union.\u00a0 And President Maurer just declared, or his<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">spokesman, that they do not need advice from the European Union<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">because they can make their own policy.\u00a0 So, I think this is all<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">a new, healthy spirit of self-consciousness and self-assertion,<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">which is very good, and can be indeed a sign of hope for<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">everybody else.<\/span><\/span><\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">GBTimes:\u00a0 How do you see it impacting Europe, their<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">participation in the BRI, in the short term, and perhaps in the<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">longer term?<\/span><\/span><\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">ZEPP-LAROUCHE:\u00a0 Well, there are different learning curves:<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">Some are quicker, others are slower.\u00a0 For example, the so-called<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">four big countries\u00a0 \u2014 that does not include Italy \u2014 that did<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">not send heads of state or government, but only ministers, Spain,<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">France, Germany, and I think Great Britain,\u00a0 by not sending their<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">heads of state sort of expressed their reservation.\u00a0 But then<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">even the German Economic Minister Altmaier, who on the first day<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">of the Belt and Road Forum basically said, &#8222;we have to have<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">transparency and rules,&#8220; with the usual kind of arguments, but<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">the next day, he said something much more positive.\u00a0 He said: Oh,<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">this was much better than I expected, the Chinese are actually<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">trying to solve problems, and I will come back in June with a<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">large delegation of businessmen.\u00a0 So, I actually find this quite<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">good.\u00a0 It shows that eventually, I think, I hope, reason will<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">prevail.<\/span><\/span><\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">GBTimes:\u00a0 I think some of the obstacles for Western<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">countries, is like Turkey refusing to participate because of the<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">Uighur problem; that there are other issues that aren&#8217;t related<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">to the Belt and Road, that China has to overcome first.<\/span><\/span><\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">ZEPP-LAROUCHE:\u00a0 All of these problems will eventually be<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">solved, because I think the key to solving of any regional,<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">ethnic, historical cultural problem is development.\u00a0 If people<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">actually see the advantage of turning non-developed countries or<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">areas into prosperous ones, into having more youth exchange,<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">young people understanding each other, people-to-people exchange,<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">dialogue of cultures, bringing forth the best tradition of each<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">culture; plus, naturally, real improvement of living standards,<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">longevity, I think that even if not all develop with the same<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">speed, we are at a tremendous change of an epoch of human<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">civilization.\u00a0 The idea of these local and regional conflicts<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">will eventually not be there any more.<\/span><\/span><\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">If I just can point to the fact that now the eight<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">radio-telescopes working together, being able to make, for the<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">first time, images of the black hole in a galaxy which is 55<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">million light-years away, proving that Einstein&#8217;s theory of<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">general relativity was actually correct \u2014 now, that, for me is<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">the sign of the future:\u00a0 Because this image could not have been<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">made by one country alone.\u00a0 It needed telescopes sited in Chile,<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">in Spain, in the United States, in the Antarctic,\u00a0 and you needed<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">the whole world actually working together to make such a<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">technological breakthrough possible.<\/span><\/span><\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">I think that that will be the kind of relationship people<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">will have to each other in the future, and I think this is what<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">Xi Jinping really is the kind of thing he means when he says, &#8222;a<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">shared community for the one future of humanity.&#8220;\u00a0 Because the<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">common interest will eventually come first, and then everything<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">else will fall into place.<\/span><\/span><\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">GBTimes: Another one of the criticisms was currently &#8222;all<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">roads lead back to Beijing&#8220; rather than a multilateral approach<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">to BRI, where it&#8217;s between other country, it always leads back to<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">China at the moment.\u00a0 Do you think that is a problem?<\/span><\/span><\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">ZEPP-LAROUCHE: I don&#8217;t know.\u00a0 First of all, I think Russia<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">has a big influence, I think the African countries are becoming<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">much more knowledgeable and confident about their own role. There<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">are many Africans who speak that, in the future, Africa will be<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">the new China with African characteristics.\u00a0 So, I think it&#8217;s all<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">changing very quickly, and those people who complain that there<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">is too much Chinese influence, well, then they should bring in<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">their active, creative contribution, and define what the new<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">platform of humanity should be.<\/span><\/span><\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">And I think China has said many times, and I have absolutely<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">every confidence that that is the case, that they&#8217;re not trying<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">to export their\u00a0 social model, but that they&#8217;re just offering the<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">experience of the incredible success of the last 40 years of the<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">form in opening-up, and basically tell developing countries,<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">&#8222;Here, if you want to have our help in accomplishing the same<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">thing, we are willing to provide it.&#8220;\u00a0 And naturally, the<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">countries of the developing sector, which had been neglected, or<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">even treated negatively by colonialism, by the IMF<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">conditionalities, when they now have the absolute, concrete offer<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">to overcome poverty and underdevelopment, why should they not<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">take it?<\/span><\/span><\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">So, I think all these criticisms are really badly covered<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">efforts to hide their own motives.\u00a0 I really think China is doing<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">the best thing which has happened to humanity for a very long<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">time, and I think the Belt and Road Initiative is the only<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">long-term plan for how to transform the world into a peaceful<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">place.\u00a0 And I think that should be applauded and people should<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">have a cooperative approach.<\/span><\/span><\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">GBTimes:\u00a0 My next question was going to be, how confident<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">are you that the BRI will pay off for China, but I get the sense<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">that you&#8217;re very confident.<\/span><\/span><\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">ZEPP-LAROUCHE:\u00a0 Oh, I think it already paying off!\u00a0 First of<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">all, it makes it more easy for China to develop its own western<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">and internal regions, because they are now sort of integrated<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">into the Belt and Road transport routes to Europe, to Central<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">Asia, integrating the Belt and Road Initiative with the Eurasian<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">Economic Union, and hopefully eventually also the European Union.<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">So I think it is already bringing benefits to China.<\/span><\/span><\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">And from an economic standpoint, the more a country exports<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">high technology goods and technologies, the more than becomes a<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">motor to develop one&#8217;s own industry even to high levels.\u00a0 So it&#8217;s<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">like a self-inspiration, so to speak, and that is already paying<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">off.\u00a0 That&#8217;s what any country should do.<\/span><\/span><\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">GBTimes:\u00a0 You mentioned technology:\u00a0 It&#8217;s also the digital<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">Silk Road, Digital Belt and Road. Of course, China has a lot of<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">control over its internet, on the Great Firewall:\u00a0 How much of a<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">barrier do you think that will be for countries to build<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">relationships via the Belt and Road Initiative?<\/span><\/span><\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">ZEPP-LAROUCHE:\u00a0 You mean the G5 question and Huawei?<\/span><\/span><\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">GBTimes:\u00a0 Well, partly that, too, but also the control of<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">the internet inside of China, which is difficult for Western<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">companies to do business, to establish themselves, as there are a<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">lot of controls there.\u00a0 Do you think that could be a barrier, as<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">part of the digital Belt and Road, that&#8217;s also being discussed.<\/span><\/span><\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">ZEPP-LAROUCHE:\u00a0 Well, I think there can be ways of making<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">arrangements which are satisfying to everybody.\u00a0 This whole<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">question of &#8222;digital control&#8220; and so forth, is highly<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">exaggerated, because, if you look at who is controlling the<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">internet, you have the big firms, Apple, Google, Facebook, and<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">they are very linked with the Western government&#8217;s.\u00a0 You know, in<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">a certain sense, after the scandal of the NSA listening into<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">everybody&#8217;s discussions, which erupted a couple of years ago and<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">which was never changed or remedied or anything, we are living in<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">a world where that already happening.\u00a0 And I think China is not<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">doing anything more than the NSA or the already mentioned GCHQ<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">doing that in the West.<\/span><\/span><\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">So I think the fact that China has a competitive system, to<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">this Western system is what causes all of this debate. Because<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">the people who had the control of the internet first, they should<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">like to keep it that way, and they regard China as a competitor,<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">which they don&#8217;t like, but that&#8217;s a fact of reality now.<\/span><\/span><\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">GBTimes:\u00a0 One question I have is why do you think the Belt<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">and Road Initiative is needed, when there&#8217;s the Asian<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">Infrastructure Investment Bank, now?\u00a0 Do you think the two are<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">mutually exclusive, or do they work together?<\/span><\/span><\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">ZEPP-LAROUCHE: No, I think the Belt and Road Initiative has<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">many financing mechanisms.\u00a0 You have the AIIB, you have the New<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">Silk Road Fund, you have a lot of the Chinese banks themselves<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">which are doing the investment.\u00a0 I have been advocating for a<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">very long time, that the West should modify its own credit<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">institutions to work on a similar principle.\u00a0 Now, that would be<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">actually very possible, because the American System of economy as<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">it was developed by Alexander Hamilton, who created the first<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">National Bank as an institution for issuing credit, that is<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">actually very close to what China is doing.\u00a0 As a matter of fact,<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">I would even go so far as to say, that the Chinese economic model<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">is much closer to the American System, as it was developed by<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">Alexander Hamilton, and then revived by Lincoln, by Henry C.<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">Carey, by Franklin D. Roosevelt; so if the United States would<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">say, we create our own national bank; and Germany, for example,<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">would say, we go back to the Kreditanstalt f\u00fcr Wiederaufbau, the<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">Credit Institution for Reconstruction, which was used for the<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">reconstruction of Germany in the postwar period, which was also a<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">state bank, \u2014 or it still is a state bank \u2014 then you could have<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">a new credit system, whereby each country would have their own<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">national bank; you would have clearing houses in between them to<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">compensate for duration of investment, or the differences between<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">small and large countries with lots of raw materials, or not so<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">much \u2014 you need these clearinghouses.\u00a0 But you could create a<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">new credit system, a New Bretton Woods system with fixed exchange<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">rates, having a stability in the system which the Western system<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">presently does not have.<\/span><\/span><\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">So, I think that the more countries go to these kinds of<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">credit financing of projects the more stable this new system will<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">become.<\/span><\/span><\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">GBTimes:\u00a0 Do you think the United States will ever become<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">part of the Belt and Road Initiative, under the Presidency of<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">Donald Trump, or perhaps whoever is voted in next<\/span><\/span><\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">ZEPP-LAROUCHE:\u00a0 That&#8217;s actually the big question, you know:<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">Will the rise of China be answered by the United States, either<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">with a war, the Thucydides trap which some people have mentioned<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">as a danger? There were in history twelve cases where a rising<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">power overtook the dominant power up to that point, and it led to<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">war; and there were four cases where it happened in a peaceful<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">way.\u00a0 Now, China, first of all, has offered that neither of these<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">two options should occur, but they have offered a special great<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">power special relationship model, based on the acceptance of the<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">other social model&#8217;s sovereignty, non-interference.\u00a0 And I think<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">Trump with his America, First policy is more inclined to respond<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">to such a model than the previous administrations of Obama and<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">Bush, who had these interventionist wars in the Middle East and<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">everywhere else for exporting their system of so-called<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">&#8222;democracy&#8220; and human rights.<\/span><\/span><\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">So I think President Trump has said very clearly that he<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">wants to have a good relationship with China.\u00a0 He calls President<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">Xi Jinping his friend all the time.\u00a0 And I think the present<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">trade negotiations actually, in my view, demonstrate that the<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">United States would suffer tremendously, if they would try to<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">decouple from the Chinese economy.\u00a0 They probably would suffer<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">more than China, because China is much more capable, in my view,<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">to compensate for the loss of the relationship with the United<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">States.<\/span><\/span><\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">But I think that the hopefully reasonable way would be to<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">say, &#8222;OK, let&#8217;s use the foreign exchange reserves of China which<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">they have in terms of U.S. Treasuries; let&#8217;s invest them through<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">an infrastructure bank in the United States, to help to modernize<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">American infrastructure.&#8220;\u00a0 And that would be an urgent need,<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">because if you look at the U.S. infrastructure, it&#8217;s really in a<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">terrible condition, and President Trump, who is talking today, I<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">think, with the leading Democrats Pelosi and Schumer on a new<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">infrastructure legislation; the sums which are discussed here,<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">from what I have heard so far, are so small!\u00a0 First of all, the<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">Republicans don&#8217;t want to have Federal spending; the Democrats<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">are talking only about &#8222;repair,&#8220; and small issues.<\/span><\/span><\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">So, what is lacking in these discussions is a grand design,<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">where you would take the approach China has taken for the<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">modernization of its infrastructure:\u00a0 To have fast train systems<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">among all the major cities, to have slow-speed maglev trains for<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">intra-urban transport.\u00a0 Now, you could take that same approach<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">and modernize the entire infrastructure of the United States. And<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">if China would, in turn, off that U.S. companies would integrate<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">more into the projects of the Belt and Road around the world, it<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">would be beneficial for both. Some American companies are already<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">doing that, like Caterpillar, General Electric, Honeywell, but<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">that could be a real incentive for the United States to go in tis<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">direction.<\/span><\/span><\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">Hopefully it will happen that way, because if not, I think a<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">clash between the two largest economies would be a catastrophe<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">for the whole world: So, let&#8217;s hope that the forces of good will<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">all work together to get to this positive end.<\/span><\/span><\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">GBTimes:\u00a0 Let&#8217;s talk about the Schiller Institute itself as<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">a think tank.\u00a0 What is your day-to-day role in the promotion of<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">the Belt and Road Initiative? How do you work to support it?<\/span><\/span><\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">ZEPP-LAROUCHE:\u00a0 Oh, you know, this all goes back to the<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">life&#8217;s work of my husband, who died recently:\u00a0 Mr. Lyndon<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">LaRouche; who spent, actually, the last 50 years, to work on very<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">concrete development projects. The first such project we<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">presented in &#8217;76 in Paris.\u00a0 This was a comprehensive plan for the<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">infrastructure development of all of Africa.\u00a0 Then we worked<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">together with the President of Mexico Jos\u00e9 L\u00f3pez Portillo on a<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">Latin American development plan \u2014 this was &#8217;82.\u00a0 We worked with<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">Indira Gandhi on a 40-year development plan, and also in the<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">beginning of the &#8217;80s, we developed a 50-year development plan<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">for the Pacific Basin. And then, when the Berlin Wall came down,<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">and the Soviet Union disintegrated, we proposed to connect the<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">European and Asian population and industrial centers through<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">development corridors, and we called that the Eurasian<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">Land-Bridge.<\/span><\/span><\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">So we have been engaged in these kinds of big projects for<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">the transformation of the world economy for the last decades, and<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">naturally, we proposed it to China in the beginning of the &#8217;90s.<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">I attended a big conference in &#8217;96 in Beijing, which had the<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">title, &#8222;The Development of the Regions along the Eurasian<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">Land-Bridge.&#8220;\u00a0 And China, at that time, declared the building of<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">the Eurasian Land-Bridge the long-term strategic aim of China by<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">2010.\u00a0 Then, naturally, came the Asia crisis in &#8217;97, so the whole<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">thing go interrupted.<\/span><\/span><\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">We were very happy when Xi Jinping announced the New Silk<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">Road in 2013, because, in the meantime, we had kept working for<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">this.\u00a0 We had <em>many<\/em>\u00a0conferences, actually hundreds of<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">conferences and seminars all over the world.\u00a0 So this is has been<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">one major point of what the Schiller Institute has been doing for<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">the last decades.\u00a0 So naturally, we are very happy that now, what<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">was only planning on our side is now being realized by the second<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">largest economy in the world, and therefore, it becomes reality:<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">And that makes quite happy.<\/span><\/span><\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">GBTimes:\u00a0 Is there anything else you&#8217;d like to add?\u00a0 I&#8217;ve<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">asked my questions and a lot more.\u00a0 Is there anything we haven&#8217;t<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">touched upon, you&#8217;d like to talk about?<\/span><\/span><\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">ZEPP-LAROUCHE:\u00a0 We could talk a little bit more about the<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">culture of the New Silk Road.<\/span><\/span><\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">GBTimes:\u00a0 Please \u2014 in what way?<\/span><\/span><\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">ZEPP-LAROUCHE:\u00a0 Well, I think that the New Silk Road, or the<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">Belt and Road Initiative, it&#8217;s not just about economics and<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">infrastructure.\u00a0 But I think equally important, if not more<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">important, in my view, is the cultural side of it:\u00a0 That it could<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">lead and will hopefully lead to an exchange of the best<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">traditions of all cultures of this world.\u00a0 And by reviving the<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">best traditions, like Confucianism in China, Beethoven in<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">Germany, and Schiller; Verdi in Italy, and so forth and so on, it<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">will ennoble the souls of the people, and I think that that is<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">the most important question right now, because I agree with<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">Friedrich Schiller, according to whom this institute is named:<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">That any improvement in the political realm can only come from<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">the moral improvement of the people.\u00a0 And therefore, I think it&#8217;s<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">also very interesting to me that President Xi Jinping has<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">emphasized the aesthetical education as extremely important,<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">because the goal of this is the beautiful mind of the pupil, of<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">the student.<\/span><\/span><\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">Now, that is exactly what Friedrich Schiller said, who in<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">the response to the Jacobin Terror in the French Revolution,<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">wrote his <em>Aesthetical Letters<\/em>\u00a0in which he develops his<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">aesthetical theory, which I find is in great cohesion with what<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">Xi Jinping is saying; and that has also to do with the fact that<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">the first education minister of the Chinese Republic studied in<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">Germany, and he studied Schiller and Humboldt; his name was Cai<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">Yuanpei\u00a0 \u2014 I&#8217;m probably pronouncing it wrong again\u00a0 \u2014\u00a0 but he<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">was the first president of the Beijing University, and I think<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">there is a great affinity, a much greater affinity between the<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">thinking of the aesthetical education as it is discussed by Xi<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">Jinping and as it does exist in the Schiller-Humboldt tradition<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">in Germany, in particular.\u00a0 I would just hope that that kind of a<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">dialogue could be intensified, because then I think a lot of the<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">prejudices and insecurities about the other culture would<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">disappear, and you would bring back and bring forth the best of<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">all sides.<\/span><\/span><\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">GBTimes:\u00a0 How could this be accomplished, do you think? What<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">sort of forms?<\/span><\/span><\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">ZEPP-LAROUCHE: You can organize conferences, you can more<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">consciously make the poetry known \u2014 I think poetry is very, very<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">important, which is naturally not so easy, because as Schiller<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">said, you have to be a poet in two languages to do justice to the<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">poetry of one language.\u00a0 You could have more conscious theater<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">performances, not just as an entertainment but involving<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">students, children, adults, and make more exhibitions, make more<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">deep-level understanding of the other culture.<\/span><\/span><\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">I think China is doing an enormous amount of that, but I<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">would have still some suggestions to make it more than<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">entertainment, because many people go to these things, and they<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">don&#8217;t quite &#8222;get it&#8220; what it&#8217;s all about; and then, it was nice,<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">but the deeper philosophical, poetical, musical meaning could be<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">made more pedagogically intelligible, and I think that would be a<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">way of opening the hearts of more people, because they would<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">recognize what treasures are there to be discovered.<\/span><\/span><\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">GBTimes:\u00a0 Do you have any closing words on the Belt and Road<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">you&#8217;d like to share with our readers?<\/span><\/span><\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">ZEPP-LAROUCHE:\u00a0 I think we are probably the generation on<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">whom later generations will look back to, and say, &#8222;Oh! This was<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">really a fascinating time, because it was a change from an epoch<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">to another one.&#8220;\u00a0 And I have an image of that, which is, this<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">change that we are experiencing right now, is probably going to<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">be bigger than the change in Europe between the Middle Ages and<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">modern times.\u00a0 In the Middle Ages you had people believing in a<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">whole bunch of axioms, the scholastics, Aristotelianism,<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">witchcraft \u2014 all kinds of strange beliefs \u2014 and then, because<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">of the influx of such thinkers as Nicholas of Cusa, or the<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">Italian Renaissance, the modern image of man, of science and<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">technology, of the sovereign nation-state, all these changes<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">happened, and they created a completely different view of the<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">image of man and of nature, and the universe, and everything we<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">call &#8222;modern society&#8220; was the result of this change.<\/span><\/span><\/span><\/p>\n<p><span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">Now, I think we are in front, or the middle of such an<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">epochal change, where the next era of mankind will be much, much<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">more creative than the present one, and that&#8217;s something to look<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">forward to, because we can actually shape it, and we can bring<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">our own creative input into it.\u00a0 And there are not many periods<\/span><\/span><\/span> <span style=\"color: #222222;\"><span style=\"font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;\"><span style=\"font-size: medium;\">in history when that is the case:\u00a0 So we are actually lucky.<\/span><\/span><\/span><\/p>\n<p data-moving=\"false\">\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>[Transcript included] Helga Zepp-LaRouche gave an excellent 42-minute video interview to GBTimes&#8216; Senior Editor Asa Butcher on May 10.\u00a0 GBTimes is a Chinese multimedia site based in Finland, and established to enhance a dialogue between China and Europe.\u00a0 Transcript GBTimes: We&#8217;ll begin.\u00a0 I&#8217;m going to focus on the Belt and Road Initiative today, following on [&hellip;]<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":26,"featured_media":53930,"comment_status":"open","ping_status":"closed","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"footnotes":""},"categories":[480,485,446],"tags":[842],"class_list":["post-53929","post","type-post","status-publish","format-standard","has-post-thumbnail","hentry","category-hzl-coverage","category-activity-coverage","category-updates-bri","tag-lang-en"],"_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/2.schillermeet.de\/de\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/53929","targetHints":{"allow":["GET"]}}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/2.schillermeet.de\/de\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/2.schillermeet.de\/de\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/types\/post"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/2.schillermeet.de\/de\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/users\/26"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/2.schillermeet.de\/de\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/comments?post=53929"}],"version-history":[{"count":8,"href":"https:\/\/2.schillermeet.de\/de\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/53929\/revisions"}],"predecessor-version":[{"id":53950,"href":"https:\/\/2.schillermeet.de\/de\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/53929\/revisions\/53950"}],"wp:featuredmedia":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/2.schillermeet.de\/de\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media\/53930"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/2.schillermeet.de\/de\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media?parent=53929"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/2.schillermeet.de\/de\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/categories?post=53929"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/2.schillermeet.de\/de\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/tags?post=53929"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}